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Old 06-24-2006, 02:56 PM   #1
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Default Making a comic/manga part 2, Creating the comic

part 2 of the part 3 series!
im gonna try to help you put together your comic, or at least show you how i do it with my comic "heat wave 2006."


Creating your comic




so first thing you gotta do is determine what you want on the page. To do that you should draw stick figures on a rough peice of paper to show all the poses you want and just roughly how you want the layout to be. Remember to experiment with angles on this rough copy and try to picture exactly how you want the page to look. I dont have a scanned example of this but you should get what i mean, its just a quick, rough, stick figure drawing of whats gonna be on the final copy.

Another thing which is good to do is think about the characters that youve created. Make sure you get their actions proper and accurate.
ALSO, always think of the dialog thats gonna be in the comic, you always wanna leave space on the side for all the speech bubbles. Its also good to think up exactly what each character is gonna say before hand so you know exactly what expressions to put in. You must always be thinking of how exactly you want the comic to look, as long as you know exactly how you want it to be it should turn out that way.

When your drawing this rouch copy, its good to look at your favorite comics before hand. your favorite comic should be Blade Of The Immortal (pm me for all the volumes free!), it is a great example to follow, infact its an amazing example to follow and if you can achieve what boti does your a god. boti displays great looking characters along with great looking backrounds AND to boot every frame seems like its well thought out and is angled perfectly. boti also exibits a good flow with its filler frames that just creates a better read.
heres some examples of blade of the immortal:
boti1
boti2
boti3
anyway, you get the idea. Lets get started

Next! start drawing!
What I usually do is draw the scene first then draw the box around it, but in Heat Wave ive been drawing the scene and drawing the box in on the computer. so this is how it looks:

Step 1

Next draw in the rest of the comic

step 2

then fix all the things that you made mistakes on

step 3

and thats what i call a good page ready to ink! ive got bg artists so i dont need to worry about doing any backround, but you should practice your backrounds! it takes longer though which is why im not doing this comic by myself. If you need help then check people on this forum, im sure some would help out if they like your idea.

script writing!!!

going along with what vts said its very important to have a good script, it makes the characters and makes the experience and! story.
its pretty difficult unless you can picture EXACTLY what you want from your comic. It wont take a few hours to come up with a complete story with events and everything, it takes time. you gotta figure out what information you want to give away and what time. there are many different ways to do this. usually you recieve more information as you go along with the character as he/she figures it out. you may learn it all at once and the the entire story is the consiquences of that. the only advice i can think of is to just constantly be thinking about your comic over a span of a week. if you need to write ideas down do so, if you need to write down exact dialog then do that too.
personally what i do to think about what exactly i want from a script or story or anything is just constantly thinking about it and options i can use to carry on the plot. not every idea will stay its just kinda like a what if scenario. what events can take place that will show you something about the character and further the plot just a little more. Id say that it takes a lot of practice to think up stuff like this. my very first comic i thought about constantly... walking to school, walking home from school, while i was drawing... .and now thinking back id say the idea was shitty. but i still got that experience of thinking up ideas and what would be cool and how things are gonna happen. thats what you gotta do, just think up exactly what you want!

maybe vts can help me out a bit cause that was a pretty vague explaination i think
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Old 06-24-2006, 05:03 PM   #2
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Yay...I know I'm about 70% to make my comic now. Alls I need is animePunk to help...
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Old 06-24-2006, 05:31 PM   #3
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cool, cant wait to see it
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Old 06-25-2006, 02:01 AM   #4
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To add on to this mofo....you should also include more on perhaps a script-process. I think personally for me it better helps your mind really visualize what you want in a page...instead of just blindly going in. Pacing is key to making a really good comic page. The thing about comics, you have to give your readers enough information per page, without giving too much...and that only comes through writing.

Not that what you have here isn't good...just not complete. I like to see other's process for making a comic, and share my insights(as I'm doing my comic right now...will post that soon). The process is definitely a challenging one, and I think with a script you can match the artwork with the dialogue almost nearly perfect, because you know what you're lookin for. This is definitely cool stuff you got here though. Keep it up, and can't wait to see more.
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Old 06-25-2006, 06:07 AM   #5
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lol very good clear steps well done i might go and try making my own comik...call it..dope fishy the 9th
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Old 06-25-2006, 06:09 AM   #6
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its hard..lolit really is
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Old 06-25-2006, 09:44 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTS_v2.0
To add on to this mofo....you should also include more on perhaps a script-process. I think personally for me it better helps your mind really visualize what you want in a page...instead of just blindly going in. Pacing is key to making a really good comic page. The thing about comics, you have to give your readers enough information per page, without giving too much...and that only comes through writing.

Not that what you have here isn't good...just not complete. I like to see other's process for making a comic, and share my insights(as I'm doing my comic right now...will post that soon). The process is definitely a challenging one, and I think with a script you can match the artwork with the dialogue almost nearly perfect, because you know what you're lookin for. This is definitely cool stuff you got here though. Keep it up, and can't wait to see more.

maybe you can help me out and give me something i can add to the tutorial.. i dont really know how to make scripts i just think them up...
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Old 06-25-2006, 11:30 AM   #8
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To quote Fred Gallagher of Megatokyo:
Quote:
A good comic, I think, is one where the drawings and the dialogue work together to create a good sense of watching the story flow. Your dialogue and your drawings don't have to show the same thing... and you can use character's expressions to contrast or convey the tone of what they are saying.
For me, writing for a comic should be simple, but not too simple. By that I mean you should have a clear direction in which you are going page by page...but that it doesn't have to be so concrete that if something doesn't work out the way you wanted to and have to start from square one(like I've done many times before^_^). Flexibility I think works for writing comics, because ultimately the drawings have to tell you more than the dialogue, but they still have to work together in a way that makes them a total package.

Script-writing for me is like this: Each panel is roughly described. I tell what's going on, who's in the panel, and sometimes I even describe the camera angles(although I usually leave that up to the artwork). Next comes the dialogue. Most people who I have seen write a script, write it and label the order of speech bubbles for each character. They way I do it is just putting the exact order. I write it in the order of who's saying it and when. For example, here's an excerpt from my script on one of pages for my comic Cram Session, in which I've been re-developing. Rough synopsis of what's going on is my character, Meechi, is on the phone with his girlfriend, Shayla.
Quote:
Panel 1: Meechi is on the phone with Shayla, walking up the stairs to his room. Back shot, mid-low camera angle to get a view of the stairs and doorway.

Meechi: What's going on, Shay?
Shayla(over phone): Um...well
And from there...I got this:(which still needs some cleaning up before I go into the color stage)


So you see, I guess you kinda have to get a feel for what it is you want to happen on the page. What's important is the interaction between the dialogue, and the drawings. Don't completely take my word for it, as this is my process, which is even simpler than what described because I scribble notes all the time trying to make things work. It's just something I've picked up in the last year or so from reading and studying comics to get a feel for the storytelling and pacing aspect. Hopefully that helps, mofo.
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Old 06-25-2006, 12:06 PM   #9
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thanks that helps. i think its possible that everyone has a different way of doing things when it comes to creating a comic, so another good tip would be to just do what you feel most comfortable with if it help you work better
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Old 07-11-2006, 09:27 AM   #10
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Here we go. Jacking into Mofo's spotlight once again, here are some notes I made on the subject a long time ago...back when I was wondering why any story I made sucked. They compare two of my favorite comics at the time. Well, I still like them...

__________________________________________________ ___________

Naruto beginning summary:

Twelve years ago a terrible nine-tailed demon fox attacked the village of Konohagakure, and though the ninja fought hard to protect their town, it was only after the village champion found a way to imprison its soul that its reign of terror ended.
Twelve years later, Naruto Uzumaki is a troublemaking orphan and one of the worst ninja at Konohagakure’s ninja school, and spends his time being the class clown and pulling pranks. His dream is to become the village champion himself one day and rule Konohagakure, and then everybody will treat him with respect at last!
But when his corrupt teacher Mizuki tricks him into stealing a forbidden scroll, Naruto finds out a shocking truth—that he is the human form of the fox demon!

One Piece beginning summary:

In the great Age of Piracy, a village boy named Monkey D. Luffy is trying to convince his idol, buccaneer Red-Haired Shanks, that he is strong and brave enough to be a pirate himself—even if he can’t swim! He vows to learn, however, so Shanks will take him along on their next voyage and he can realize his dream!
He changes his mind when Shanks is humiliated by bandits, and then a startling realization occurs—Luffy has accidentally eaten the cursed Gum-Gum fruit and gained the ability to stretch like rubber, but at the cost that he will never be able to swim again!


What do these beginnings have in common?
Both star a young boy who commits himself to a dream that right then seems impossible; both heroes are striving for recognition among the people around them; both first villains appear in the first chapter and end in the first chapter; both heroes don’t seem to have parents; both are shocked by discovering something about themselves that they didn’t reckon on/impedes their path to their goals, and both decide to keep fighting for their dreams anyway!

What differences to they have?
Naruto and Luffy’s personalities are radically different; Naruto was hated by everybody who knew he was the fox demon, Luffy is basically liked by his townspeople, though some disagree with his dream of becoming a pirate; Naruto is betrayed by his teacher as a first villain, Luffy watches Shanks being humiliated and later attacks the bandits for talking bad of him; Naruto’s rival, Sasuke, appears in a later chapter and stays through the story because he is a much better ninja than Naruto, Luffy has no rivals but fights enemies that appear as he travels; Naruto is an action/fighting/fantasy-oriented manga, One Piece, though it’s action-filled too, has more adventure and character development, in that every character has an urgent personal agenda (most of the main characters have their own childhood dreams to accomplish)




Why are they interesting?
Naruto’s storyline not only involves the awesome tricks and abilities of the ninja, such as transformation, super-powered martial arts, doppelgangers, throwing stars, illusions, and elemental magic—but, as it follows the young ninja through the trials of exams, school, and other juvenile troubles, it actually shows how kid ninja are trained, which is what I liked about Harry Potter too. All this is complemented by an element of fantasy and a surprisingly deep, if flawed, plot; the fox demon that was sealed into Naruto and the ‘village hidden in the leaves’ all add an element of Japanese mythology to the story.

One Piece, in contrast, is a story of piracy, treasure-hunting, dreams, and wacky villains that emerge to trouble Luffy as he leaves his hometown to sail the seas and become king of the pirates, raise a super-crew, and finally find Gold Roger’s lost treasure, One Piece. Apart from the original plot, the battle scenes in One Piece are well rendered, the characters and villains are diverse, and you really feel the adventure of traveling the seas; also the art style is slightly wacky, setting One Piece apart from other Japanese comics. The sense of humor is consistent and Luffy’s array of rubber-stretching super abilities (his Gum-Gum Pistol punch, Gum-Gum Rocket jump, etc.) aid him in everything from fights with axe-handed sailors and hordes of enemy pirates, to any obstacles he runs into on the high seas.

How do they pull the reader into the story?
I suppose Naruto has the said fox demon thing and the great ninja powers, but also there is the ramshackle, sprawling look of Konohagakure itself; the buildings built on top of one another, traditional Japanese-style roofs and scroll-like billboards, the faces of the village champions carved into the mountainsides—almost like that ninja village in Final Fantasy VII.

One Piece, as I mentioned, has the cool ‘rounded’ art style, the swashbuckling subject of pirates and treasure, the occasionally funny but appealing character designs, and the way the characters’ personalities are always shown through what they do and what people think of them. The narrative in One Piece is also very good and the plot is deep without lagging.

How do they keep a reader dying to read the next page?
Both try to use good composition, camera angles, a carrying story, plenty of action, and well-designed panels to keep the reader interested, but I prefer One Piece’s to Naruto—perhaps because of the art. However, they both show the characters’ emotions well.

What is changing in the hero’s life?
In Naruto, Naruto is trying to graduate from the ninja academy and receive the Konohagakure headband that will signify his becoming a full-fledged ninja, but he failed the final test two times before and when his master, Iruka, fails him a third time because he cannot produce a doppelganger, Naruto loses hope. He has always been despised by the grown-ups of the village and he had no parents to support him; when he is tricked by Mizuki, who tells him he can graduate if he learns the techniques in that scroll, he is shocked to learn his true identity, and even more shocked to learn that Iruka’s own parents died in the great battle against the fox demon twelve years ago. However, he learns that Iruka, rather than despising him, holds him in the highest respect because he trains with all his might; he sympathizes with Naruto for trying to get attention by getting in trouble, and is being hard on him only because Naruto reminds him of himself and Iruka wants him to be strong.

In One Piece, Luffy learns the difference between being a brave and honorable man and being a big-talking loser who likes to pick a fight, though he doesn’t know it at first. Believing that Shanks was a coward for allowing the bandits to make fun of him, he is disappointed; but he learns later that Shanks is not only brave, but had a very good reason for not taking him to sea. He decides to become just like him one day, and raise his own crew instead of begging Shanks to take him in.

Why does the reader care about anything that happens to the hero?
Without even knowing it really, we relate to Naruto because he wants attention, recognition, strength, and respect, but he is also a hapless troublemaking prankster, so we wonder how he will end up. When he becomes a full-fledged ninja and teams up with his rival Sasuke and his crush Sakura, they travel with their elite teacher Kakashi to the land of the Waves and learn more ninja techniques as they fight in battles and undergo hard training regimens.

In One Piece, the reader would want to know what happens next just to see where Luffy and his crew will end up and who they will fight next, but there is also the many other characters they interact with. Luffy helps a sick girl who lives in a mansion by defeating her evil butler who is after her fortune and is actually the captain of a notorious pirate gang called the Black Cat Pirates, while at the same time taking on a village youth known for his tall tales named Usopp as one of his crew. After that...whoa! He’s fallen in with some tough cooks who run an oceangoing ship-restaurant called Baratie! It’s a solid adventure with plenty of action and humor.

How do they portray the villain(s)?
In Naruto, at first master Mizuki seems to be a nice guy—he asks Iruka if they can give Naruto a break, since he failed twice before—but it turns out later that he was using Naruto because he wanted the scroll for himself, and it is he who breaks the secret to Naruto about his past; all the villagers were bound by a strict decree to never tell.

In One Piece, Higuma the Bear, leader of the bandits, arrives at Luffy’s village tavern asking for ten barrels of grog, and is furious when informed that they just ran out of it. Red-Haired Shanks offers him the last bottle, which he hasn’t opened yet, and Higuma smashes it saying what good is one bottle of grog? He threatens Shanks since he is a wanted man and breaks more bottles over him. Shanks does not start a brawl; he apologizes to the proprietor of the tavern and asks for a rag to clean up the mess. Higuma leaves with his gang, and everybody laughs at how he got Shanks good—even Shanks joins in. Only Luffy doesn’t find this funny; he thinks his hero should have defended his honor and fought Higuma, and won’t listen to anybody else!

Do we find out right away who is the bad guy, or is it revealed later?
At the beginning of Naruto, as mentioned before, we suspect Mizuki is simply another teacher who feels sorry for Naruto. His true intentions only come out later.

In One Piece, Higuma shows up in the second scene while Luffy and Shanks are both eating at the tavern, and it is clear that he is a villain, though he leaves and comes into the story later.
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Old 07-11-2006, 09:28 AM   #11
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Is there a small-time villain who only lasts one chapter, or a great overlord-type villain who is tormenting the hero and/or his friends throughout the entire story?
Both Naruto and One Piece’s first villains are small-timers.

Is one type of villain more interesting to have than the other? Why?
The small-timing villain, such as Higuma, is sometimes cooler because he is already in the story, he is near, and there doesn’t have to be a huge mountain to climb to reckon with him. This type of villain is good for bringing the killer element into the story, giving the reader a taste of the story’s overall plot right at the beginning, or creating a conflict that will be resolved in the next two chapters, at most, before the story continues on something else.

The overlord-type villain, however, has some interesting possibilities. Overlords are villains who usually do harm to the hero (metaphorically or physically) at the beginning, before he knows anything about them, and then might leave for the rest of the story and only appear at the very end of a huge epic journey that the hero takes to overthrow them once and for all. They are usually powerful, mysterious, and have a deep connection to a great evil power, though this doesn’t always apply to all of them.
Lan Di is an overlord villain in Shenmue, and Darth Vader is one in Star Wars; it is a common plot device that the overlord kills the hero’s father/master/best friend/pet and the hero trains, goes looking for answers, smashes up some of the villains’ thugs, gets ambushed by his minions, and sets himself on the path of revenge against that overlord villain. However, this type of villain is not as direct as the small-timer; to keep the focus on him, the writer might keep putting reminding elements into the story, such as the aforementioned ambush by his minions.
Usually this villain has a slew of small-timer minions that the hero faces off against, who can be street gang leaders, insanely lethal swordsmen, military commandoes, killer androids or anything that fits the theme—the important thing is the hero must get past them to reach his next objective.
Through seeking revenge, the hero might have to travel a long way, and more characters come into the story to either help or halt him. Sometimes, at the end, the villains’ true identity comes out and shocks us all—“Luke, I am your father”-kind of shock, or “Luke, I want you to become my successor, since you’re such a bad dude and all the way you smashed up my thugs”. Either way, the hero must make very hard choices, which reveal his character even more. This villain is sometimes what really makes a hero cool and an epic story dynamic, since often the hero must grow from being a sheltered brat to a strong and determined warrior.
There are variations of the small-timer and overlord villains too.


Does this villain hurt/betray/mislead the hero first, or does the hero provoke him somehow and they end up rivals? Or something in between?
In Naruto, Mizuki tricks, then betrays Naruto, and then tries to kill him to get the scroll. Iruka saves Naruto by becoming his doppelganger, and when Naruto hears how Iruka respects him, he stops Mizuki from killing Iruka—and then defeats Mizuki by using the art he learned in the stolen scroll, making one thousand perfect, solid doppelgangers of himself! (This is called a knockout ending)

In One Piece, Higuma never attacks Luffy directly—but he humiliates his idol in front of him, which induces Luffy to attack him at a later time when they are talking bad about Shanks in front of him, too. Shanks arrives and saves Luffy from the bandits, who are beating up on him—and Luffy learns his lesson. (An emotional kind of knockout, but it works)

How does the story carry on?
Iruka watches Naruto knock Mizuki out with his doppelgangers and then gives Naruto his own headband, which means he passed the test. Then, as I said before, he is partnered with Sasuke and Sakura to train under the elite ninja Kakashi who gives them their ninja assignments, which send them off to other lands and put them in duty protecting people.

I’ve already said how One Piece carries on; Luffy grows up and sets sail from his village to find the legendary One Piece and explore the seas.

Both of these formats leave the plot open for many future adventures and possibilities of new characters coming into the story, and more being discovered about the main characters themselves.
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